00:00:00 Thanks for joining us on episode 761 of the inspired stewardship podcast. Hi, I'm Dan Miller from 48 days.com. I challenge you to invest in yourself, invest in others, develop your influence and impact the world by using your time, your talent and your treasures, Deliv out your calling. Having the ability to find the work you love is key. And one way to be inspired to do that is to listen to this inspired stewardship podcast with my friend,
00:00:32 Scott Mader. I love the word stewardship and what I think about first and foremost is the story of the talents in the Bible. And that's not just about money that's about, did you use what you were given the ability to do well, and I really take that seriously. I don't want to show up and be found out that I didn't use the telescope I've given me well welcome.
00:01:07 And thank you for joining us on the inspired stewardship podcasts. If you truly desire to become the person who God wants you to be, then you must learn to use your time, your talent and your treasures for your true calling and the inspired stewardship podcast school. Learn to invest in yourself, invest in others and develop your influence so that you can impact the world.
00:01:39 And today's interview with Dan Miller. Dan and I talk with you about how he's maintained a focus for 20 years on one message and yet how that's also adapted to the times. Dan and I also share with you how you can overcome the naysayers when you start something new. And I also asked Dan to talk with you about how you can support someone else without being a Pollyanna.
00:02:05 One reason I like to bring you great interviews. Like the one you're going to hear today is because of the power in learning from others. Another great way to learn from others is through reading books. But if you're like most people today, you find it hard to find the time to sit down and read. And that's why today's podcast is brought to you by audible,
00:02:26 go to inspired stewardship.com/audible to sign up and you can get a 30 day free trial. There's over 180,000 titles to choose from. And instead of reading, you can listen your way to learn from some of the greatest minds out there. That's inspired stewardship.com/audible to get your free trial and listen to great books. The same way you're listening to this podcast. Dan Miller,
00:02:54 president of 48 days, LLC specializes in creative thinking for increased Personal and business success. He believes that meaningful work blends our natural skills and abilities, our unique personality traits and our dreams and passions. He believes that a clear sense of direction can help us become all that God designed us to be. Dan is the author of the widely acclaimed 48 days for the work you love and no more Mondays books.
00:03:23 48 days was recently released in a 20 year anniversary edition. He hosts his podcast and is the founder of the online community that I belong to called the 48 days Eagles. And there's many active entrepreneurs there. I've learned a lot about how I view my vocation from Dan, his books and listening to him over the years. And I consider him one of my virtual mentors.
00:03:47 Oh, and by the way, Dan and his wife, Joanne have three wonderful children and 17 grandchildren to celebrate as well. Welcome to the show, Dan. Well, thank you. I've been looking forward to our conversation Last week. We talked a little bit about how the 48 days message has remained the same despite changing times. And I know, because again,
00:04:13 I've had interactions with you over the years. I've seen you coaching, I've seen you doing masterminds. I've seen you presenting to the 48 days Eagle community. You're constantly looking for ways to pour into others. How long, how have you kept that kind of focus on pouring into others that consistently lately for that long of a period of time? Now it's a thoughtful question for sure,
00:04:38 but I have to admit it's because of the affirmation and a satisfaction that I get. So in that sense, I guess it's fairly selfish, but the testimonials that I get, my goodness, I mean, I got a text just this morning and it was just that affirmation of the impact that my materials had in somebody's life. And I said, you know,
00:05:01 that's what keeps me going. That's what keeps me doing the same thing. Now the same thing though really has changed a lot because I've found ways to increase the impact of that message through technology, through having groups, masterminds, online, community, more products, seminars, workshops, courses that people can go through. So the leverage of that as allowed that to expand pretty exponentially.
00:05:31 So it's not just me sitting down and having coffee with my buddy Scott at Starbucks, you know, encouraging them. But I've found ways where I can take that same message and expand it. So, you know, I think one of the challenges that I see people run into, and in fact, I was, I, this morning I was having a conversation with a client and they were talking about how people that were important to them in some way were beginning to naysay and kind of poo-pooed the changes they were making in their life.
00:06:06 Cause they were, they were doing some things different and it was uncomfortable. Can you talk about how, you know, how can people deal with that negative messaging that comes oftentimes along with doing something that's quote non-traditional, you know, not going in, just quote, getting a nine to five. Yeah. That is, that is such a common malady for people where often the people closest to them are not supportive of making changes.
00:06:35 And it's pretty easy to understand, and it's also pretty straight forward in how to deal with it. But you can recognize if you're working with guys on the assembly line at a manufacturing plant, and you start to talk about the fact that you got this little idea, you know, you're going to sell specialty cars and you know, you can even market those to people that don't live in your geographic area and you can make $4,000 a piece doing that.
00:07:00 And all of a sudden, you know, you're talking about making a hundred thousand dollars, you're not likely to have the guy standing next to you say, Oh man, that's great. You know, I really wish you, well, they're going to say, are you kidding me? You know, you never even went to college. What are you doing?
00:07:14 Thinking about something, nobody in your family's ever done. Nobody in our towns ever done anything like that, or you can't do that now. That's just totally unrealistic. That's highly likely what you're going to hear. And then you go to you, you show up at Thanksgiving dinner and there are people there who have never made more than X number of dollars because of the traditional kinds of jobs they've done.
00:07:38 I mean, I have a lot of educators in my family who never made more than 60 or $70,000 a year. If I show up and start talking about getting book advances and royalty income and having a thousand people in a community that are paying $48 a month, you know, those people are going to, it's not going to sit well. So you have to be looking for people.
00:08:03 We're going to cheer you on. And the easiest way to do that is find people who are ahead of you on the success path that you want to pursue. Those people will cheer you on. You know, I lived for years in Nashville, Tennessee, and there's a whole lot of people who come there who want to make it in music. And there are talented,
00:08:23 talented musicians were living in cardboard boxes under bridges because they've never really quite figured it out. And there are a whole lot of people who in coming to town will tell you, you can't make it in music in this town. I mean, the days of Taylor Swift and you know, Justin Timberlake, these people that came through here, Keith urban, you know,
00:08:41 those days are gone. You can't do it. You know what? Those are people who have not been able to do it themselves, but you talk to Taylor Swift or you talk to Brad Paisley or my neighbor, Luke Bryan, you to them because it was sure you can, the opportunities are amazing. Let me tell you what I did. So the same thing is true.
00:09:02 No matter what level you're at find people who are a little farther ahead of you associate with them and you'll find your belief, your confidence in your true success starts to escalate. I know that can be tough. You know, when you're that close to you and you, we don't want to turn our back on valued relationships, but w where it really gets tough.
00:09:26 Got, I don't know if you want to open this case. Yeah, absolutely. Keep going. This is valuable feedback That we get every time we talk about this more, I so gently laid that out, just hanging around people who are encouraging you on, you know, the, the feedback we'll get is what if it's my spouse, right? Or my mother or my sister or my,
00:09:46 yeah. What if it's somebody I live with? Who's not encouraging me and granted, I know that's tough. I know that I have been so spoiled in having the unconditional support of my wife day after day after day through every iteration of what I've done. And I know that's not always the case, but even so I have not just looked to her,
00:10:15 but I've also looked for other people out there be those virtual mentors or people that I can really get together with personally, face to face. I look for people where I can be inspired by the level of their achievement and where they are going to encourage me. And, and I often think, you know, they're there, I think there's two different sources for some of the naysaying and see if this resonates with what you've seen.
00:10:40 You know, one is kind of the fellow worker on the assembly line that, you know, because they've never done it. They don't believe it's possible. And, and so it's, it's really a lack of any sort of belief. And I think a lot of times with the spouse or the sister or the brother, they equate doing it the traditional way with safety and they want you to be safe.
00:11:01 They want you to be, you know, okay. And so they, they're thinking of it as being, you know, I'm actually helping you be safe as opposed to I'm holding you back from a dream or from a passion or from something that may turn out to be even better. Yeah, absolutely. And, and, you know, I, that's why I love what you said last week,
00:11:23 where you mentioned that if you take your, your corporate skill and you go out into the world with it and you find a whole bunch of clients, then you're moving from really, and truly being self-employed with one customer, your company that's employing you to self-employed with 10 or 20 or 30, or however many clients you have in some ways that, yes,
00:11:47 it's less safe in some ways, but it's also more safe in some ways, because there's diversity of clients too. And, you know, I worked for a company that did layoffs well, when a company is doing layoffs, you're one employer, you're one customer decides to lay you off. You're, you're, you're looking for a job or you're looking for the next thing.
00:12:07 Oh, you're exactly right. And if you, if you have a hot dog down on the main street in your town, you know, you may have 276 people that come by every day and buy a hot dog. Well, those friends back into assembly on are going to see that as really risky, but they're in a position as you described where they're one decision away from being on the street.
00:12:27 Whereas if you have that hotdog stand and you have one person decides they don't like your hot dogs, it doesn't make a dent in what you're doing, because you have so many other customers. We have a, of a young guy in my mastermind and he's pretty young and, you know, has been working responsibly and decided he wanted to get into real estate while everybody in his family warned him against it.
00:12:52 You know, it's so volatile and risky, stupid you'll risk your money, you'll lose your money. Well, he did a couple pretty small deals and he did deals where purchase price was really low and the cashflow was phenomenal and that he could get way more than a monthly obligation in terms of cash flow from rental. And he's chose section eight housing where the government,
00:13:19 the government insures the rental. Well, he did about three of those. And all of a sudden was making more cashflow from his rental property than from his job. He had family members showing him, Hey, can we go together with, you know, here's some money we will, you invest. It was It's stupid. It was hilarious Quickly, their view on that turned around.
00:13:43 And that's really true in any of what we're talking about. The old adage is success is the greatest revenge. And without being revengeful, we just know that it is success changes, people's attitude. If it was a spouse who's not supportive or a mom or dad or whoever it is, a little success changes those attitudes pretty quickly. So let's flip it around a little bit.
00:14:07 And, you know, I'm also blessed with an incredibly supportive wife. And so when I was working my corporate job, she was ready for me to leave before I was, you know, and so let's give her some advice now, you know, when, when you're the other way, and you see somebody has a passion and is trying to go out there and launch and do their thing,
00:14:29 how can we encourage them to do that without either, you know, being a Pollyanna or pushing too hard or making other mistakes that we can make? Well, it helps if that person, if you are the encourager, it helps. If you are informed enough to really understand it. So it's not just an empty attaboy, you can do it. You know,
00:14:49 you want to jump off the side of a cliff and they're saying, Hey, go ahead. You know, it'll probably work out, okay. Yeah, we don't need that. But if somebody has invested enough time to be at least minimally and knowledgeable about what it is we're doing, and I do that with, with my wife, and I'm sure you do where we,
00:15:06 if I'm approaching something new, I want her to know about it enough that she can really understand it. Even if it's not something she would do, but she knows me well. And if she sees an idea and I also in the same sense, then value her caution. If it comes from somebody I do know has my best interest at heart. And she is informed enough to have a realistic understanding of it.
00:15:31 I'm going to also pay attention. If there is a caution from somebody like that. And I looked for that. I don't want everybody just to say yes, my goodness. I don't want, you know, my, my sphere of friends. I mean, I surround myself with contemporaries of mine and peers who I want to challenge my ideas. I don't want everybody around me just to say yes,
00:15:52 that would be great. You can do no wrong. That that would be scary. Yeah. It's be being open to being challenged. And yet also, you know, for those folks around us, I think it's like, it's about informed information and as opposed, and again, that gets back to the naysayers too. I think sometimes the reason there are naysayers out of a lack of information,
00:16:17 not always, but sometimes Yes, absolutely. So in this new edition, one of the things you point out and it's, it's, again, it's a topic that I've, I've worked with both as a coach and then worked on with myself too, because I see it is this idea of the upper limit problem. Could you explain to listeners what the upper limit problem is?
00:16:40 And again, if, if we're dealing with it or if we see others dealing with it, how are some ways that we can support people to kind of break through that, that mindset, that limiting, Wow, th this is, I mean, I appreciate you bringing it up. This is really, I mean, almost the elephant in the room,
00:16:57 in some situations, the upper limit challenge means we all have a sense of what we deserve, and this is really true in the faith community. We kind of have a sense, you know, our role here is to just kind of get by don't screw things up too bad. And then it will go to go to heaven, but it's probably not to,
00:17:19 you know, make a million dollars a year as an example. Well, if we have that belief, then that's going to become our reality. So we all have that kind of sense of what we deserve. When I work with somebody who is looking at a traditional job, I see them give themselves about a $10,000 window. So if somebody's used to making $70,000,
00:17:39 they'll look at an opportunity that makes 65, 75. But if there's a position that becomes available and it pays $140,000, it's exactly what they do. What they're competent to walk into. They often don't even apply because they think no, somehow that's probably beyond me. So here's how this comes back down. I'm going to get there exactly what you asked me in the regular work model,
00:18:04 where somebody has a job. People often get a three to 4% increase annually. They can deal with that. So if you're making that 70,000 next year, you're going to make 74. Fantastic. You know, we can go to Disneyland this year with our kids. It's that little bit of increase. You can live with that. But what have you take knowledge that you have?
00:18:22 And you develop a course, if a young guy who was working as a photo journalist, he was making about $38,000 a year, loved what he was doing, but knew that, that didn't give him a lot of options, making that kind of money. We encouraged him to put together a course. He put together a course where he taught parents how to take these spectacular shots of your kids,
00:18:43 right at the moment where the bat hits the ball, or they keep winning soccer goal. You know, those how to capture those. You put that little course out, developed it over a couple of weeks, put that little course out on a Friday night and in a 48 hour period, he generated more income than ever made annually in his job. There's that kind of potential.
00:19:05 What if you write a book and the book produces 10 times income you've ever experienced, what we find is that people often sabotage that here. Here's a real Gorian example. We find a kid who lives down in Mississippi, in abject poverty has never known anything but poverty. Oh my gosh, he's got a throwing arm. Like we've never seen. We bring him to Nashville,
00:19:29 Tennessee signing with the Tennessee Titans, give them a $10 million bonus because he's got such an amazing skill. What often happens 10 years, 10 or six months later, he spent the 10 million and more is made decisions that have ruined his career. He's back where he came from, because his sense of deserving didn't match the reality of what he was given so quickly.
00:19:52 And he sabotaged it to go back down. Joanne and I have helped countless gals coming out of the Tennessee prison for women. And we learned some really good, clear lessons. We'd bring them out. A lot of times they had a very broken background in every way. We put them in a nice apartment, give them a car, help them get a job.
00:20:15 And they sabotage it until they go back down to a level where they're comfortable and then slowly work their way up. Now, this is a big issue when we see the kind of opportunities we have today, because w and what the implication is, and it's really clear is if you want to become a millionaire, if we just keep it in the financial arena here for a minute,
00:20:37 he has a so quantifiable. If you want to become a millionaire, you need to be prepared philosophically, psychologically, emotionally, spiritually, for that before the reality of the money ever shows up, if you're not, you'll sabotage it. So when we have these kinds of opportunities, I mean, I'm, I'm very humbled. My dad was a very poor Armour,
00:20:59 and I'm humbled by the fact that on a good day, I generate more income than my dad ever did in a year. And I had to, I had to get used to that idea that wasn't something I just waltzed into. And I still deal with the kind of things where wow, Joanne wants to tear the kitchen apart and put in new cupboards and new quartz countertops.
00:21:23 When what we have is fully functional. Can we do that? I struggle with that. And I think it's still wise to, to struggle with that. I mean, I see behind you, the sign about inspired stewardship, there is an issue of stewardship there. It doesn't mean to become frivolous, but sometimes we block the opportunity to walk into more prosperous,
00:21:43 more fulfilling seasons of our life, simply because we have that upper limit challenge. It, it it's because it can challenge our identity, you know, we're having to change and say, we're a different person in a way. That's right. And except that, yeah, again, I know I've struggled with that over the years. I, I, you know,
00:22:06 self-sabotage, or, or sabotaging success is, and then I've seen it in, you know, get employees, friends, family members, and others. So exactly what you're talking about is definitely something, Something as simple as driving a car, you know, to my dad, a car was for basic transportation. I agree with your dad, cars were black,
00:22:33 and it didn't matter how old they were. The only reason was to get you from point a to point B the idea of having a car would give you some sense of pride or joy, or just inspiration and Polish. And that was so foreign to him. And it really is the same concept, that upper limit challenge, where you have to break through that kind of thinking if you're going to move,
00:22:56 move on, and I don't want to make this just about, you know, more money, it's about more fulfillment, more joy. There are people who sabotage relationships because they think I don't deserve something so fulfilling as this. So it is Real because it feels too good. Absolutely. So it goes into any area of our lives. Yeah. And I think,
00:23:18 like you said, it's, it's easy to quantify it when we talk about it in the money realm, but, but you're right. It can definitely show up it, you know, and get productivity. You know, I used to have the identity that I don't know if this maybe will resonate with someone else of, you know, I'm somebody that works well under pressure.
00:23:35 So I'm not procrastinating, I'm putting it off so that I'll get it done when I'm at my best. Wow. That was bull, You know, because guess what, when spent six hours extra Audit and worked out at LA, you know, and started on time and ended up, I did much better work, you know, but, but you kind of have that.
00:23:53 I, and I think it's kind of a different way of the same thing. Right. You know, cause I was at, I was sabotaging my best work with this kind of identity of being someone that, you know, it was almost a badge of honor, if that makes sense. Absolutely. And there are people who have been offered promotions, just like I described,
00:24:10 given the young kid of football, you know, bonus because we signed him to a major team. Now people can be given a promotion and sabotage it because the upper limit challenge, they look around and think, wow, you know, I probably don't really deserve this Greg over in a corner. It can do this better than I, and they sabotage it.
00:24:32 So I'm going to ask you a question that I try to ask all of my guests at one time or another, and it's going to be a little bit of a surprise to you, but, but I wanted to, to ask you this too, we talked a little bit before we started the recording about stewardship and how that word was important to you.
00:24:52 Would you share what your definition of that word stewardship is? Wow. I love the word stewardship and what I think about first and foremost is the story of the talents and the Bible. And that's not just about money. It's about, did you use what you are given the ability to do well? And I really take that seriously. I don't want to show up and be found out that I didn't use the talents God had given me well.
00:25:24 So whatever that means, that means. So it also goes to the idea. We see a lot of the work model in our culture in America, at least where the idea is get to the point where you have everything that you need for yourself and then stop, stop being productive just coast. That just makes my blood cringe. I mean, I just cringe when I think about that,
00:25:51 because I think there's a stewardship issue involved there. If I have all the money that I need, thank goodness for the opportunities have gotten me there that gives me no right to stop and unplug. That means that I have been, that I've been given the responsibility, had been found faithful in something small. I need to continue doing that. So as uses the term out of the old Testament,
00:26:13 blessed to be a blessing. So whatever I'm producing, even though it overflows my cup, it then gives me a saucer full that I can share generously with others. So stewardship means continuing to do things that show your productivity that are an expression of your skills and talents to do that. Well, not just for an end goal in mind, which continuously,
00:26:39 I mean, I, my, my goal is write a chapter of my next book in the morning and go to my funeral that afternoon. Oh, well, I hope that's not any time soon because you continue to be a blessing in my life. So hopefully that's not, anytime soon you can follow Dan on twitter@fortyeightdaysteamrfindhimonhiswebsiteatfortyeightdays.com and that's the number's 48. He's also active on LinkedIn at 48 days.
00:27:13 And Dan has made a free gift available, including how you can get a free chapter of the book and some other great resources available over@fortyeightdays.com slash for inspired stewardship. I'll have links to all of these in the show notes as well. Dan, is there anything else you'd like to share with the listener? You know, there's something, as you've talked,
00:27:34 I've gotten a better feel for who your audience is and how you think. And you know, so often I hear people who think they've missed their window of opportunity. And I hear from 27 year olds who think they majored in the wrong thing in college, you know, now they just have to kind of coast into the grave now, Oh my goodness,
00:27:50 you aren't even old enough to ask the right questions yet, hang in there. But if there's one piece of encouragement, I'd love to leave with your listeners. It's that it's never too late to have a new beginning. So it doesn't matter if you're 27 or if you're 57 or 77, it may be a time where you have fresh insight into really what your core passions are.
00:28:14 The things that you really have to offer that could make a dent in the universe. And now's the time to step into that. And you can walk into the most productive, fulfilling time of your life. So never too late to have a new beginning. Awesome. Thank you so much for coming on. And it has been great to have you thank you so much.
00:28:32 Got my honor. Thanks so much for listening to the inspired stewardship podcast as a subscriber and listener, we challenge you to not just sit back and passively listen, but act on what you've heard and find a way to live your calling. If you enjoy this episode, please, please do us a favor. Go over to inspired stewardship.com/itunes rate. All one word iTunes rate.
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