Episode 1684: Interview with David Savage about His Book The Savage Path

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Scott Maderer: [00:00:00] Thanks for joining us on episode 1,684 of the Inspired Stewardship Podcast.

David Savage: Howdy, I'm David Savage. I challenge you to invest in yourself, invest in others, develop your influence, and impact the world by using your time, your talent, and your treasures to live out your calling. Having the ability to recognize that God has already won is key, and one way to be inspired to do that is to listen to this, the Inspired Stewardship Podcast, with my friend, Scott Maderer.

I was a, I got elected to be a delegate to the National Republican Convention. And then in 2024, I sought for and became elected a delegate to the Republican National Convention again. So for 16 years, I was really gonna make the difference myself[00:01:00]

Scott Maderer: Welcome and thank you for joining us on the Inspired Stewardship Podcast. If you truly desire to become the person who God wants you to be, then you must learn to use your time, your talent, and your treasures for your true calling. In the Inspired Stewardship Podcast, you will learn to invest in yourself, invest in others, and develop your influence so that you can impact the world

In today's podcast episode, I interview David Savage. I asked David about how he came to feel called to write his book, The Savage Path. I also asked David to share with you what he's seen around pride and how it can go wrong And I also asked David about his discovery that he's still on the journey to discover faith and submission.

I have a great book that's been out for a while now called Inspired [00:02:00] Living: Assemble the Puzzle of Your Calling by Mastering Your Time, Your Talent, and Your Treasures. You can find out more about that book over at inspiredlivingbook.com. It'll take you to a page where there's information, and you can sign up to get some mailings about it, as well as purchase a copy there.

I'd love to see you get a copy and share with me how it impacted your world. My guest today is David Savage, a podcaster, a poet, and an author after retiring from a career as a global energy executive. His passion is helping other men with the daily spiritual warfare we all face, utilizing his lifelong experiences, strong Christian faith, humor, and storytelling skill.

David Savage: Welcome to the show,

Scott Maderer: David.

David Savage: Hey, thanks Scott. Glad to be on.

Scott Maderer: Absolutely. I look forward to our conversation today. We met back at PodFest and connected there, and then have had a few conversations since then. Uh, a [00:03:00] lot of like-minded and different-minded at the same time, which is always fun to, to talk to people where, where you, you have those connections and those things that you share.

So I talked a little bit in the intro about some of the work you do around podcasting, around your book, and around the Christian faith and missionary work, and not direct mission, but missionary work or mission work that you do. And yet I've always thought of, of intros or the stories that we tell they show where we're at today, but they really don't show how we got there.

So take us back in time and share a little bit about the, the messy journey that brought you to the point today where this is the message that you feel called to put out into the world.

David Savage: Well, I would say that everyone's life is a little bit messy. And, uh, and, and mine certainly is, too. We, uh, we have our [00:04:00] ideals and, you know, I was I was raised in a, uh, I was an Air Force brat, and my mom was really kind of the spiritual influence in my life.

And, you know, my dad less interested in going to church. But my mom, she made sure we always went to church with, even when we were living overseas and, you know, we went to the, the Protestant service at the Air Force base. And, and so I was, uh, baptized and confirmed for the first time in seventh grade, and I was pretty, you know, devout.

I really was heavily involved in scouting and- Of course, you know, I graduate from high school, and then I get a scholarship to Texas A&M right there where you live in Bryan-College Station, you know. And, uh, and I had some other- Yeah, we,

Scott Maderer: we share that in common too.

David Savage: Yeah, I chose, I chose Texas A&M, and I went in as a nuclear engineering major.

Oh, wow. Very idealistic. And, uh, you know, I had g- great SAT scores, really good at math and stuff. And then, uh, that was in 1978. 1979, Three Mile Island. [00:05:00] Decided that I needed to change majors. And, and that same year, it was a very pivotal year, I got dumped by the girl I fell head over heels in love with.

And man, I mean, that really scarred my heart. And and I, I remember in College Station, it's kinda high humidity and gray and rainy, like in January. And I think that January of 1979, it rained 30 out of 31 days, and I was just in a funk, you know? I was like, "I can't believe... You know, I'm so fortunate to have this scholarship.

I'm here at Texas A&M, and, and I let this girl turn my head, and I've been... You know, and I can't focus on my studies." and so I made this rigid promise to myself, you know, that I was not gonna let another female let me deviate, you know, from my mission, you know, there at school. And I met a lot of really nice girls for the rest of my time there at A&M, but I, as soon as I felt any vulnerability to, uh, you know, my heart, I would just drop, you know, any- anything like a [00:06:00] relationship.

And they were, they were quite puzzled by that. And then when I graduated in 1982, my parents, after 31 years, got a divorce, my brother got divorced, and my sister got divorced. Oh, wow. So the whole idea of relationship and maturity in relationship was, uh, I was underdeveloped. And so, you know, now I get my degree.

I'm a civil engineer. I'm working in consulting in Houston and, and then in Austin. And I just, uh, I just said, "I'm n- I'm never gonna get married." And, uh, I just had a really bad vibe about it. And but I, I liked women, and, you know, and I wasn't really in the right place spiritually as a Christian and everything else.

And so, you know, I was having premarital sex, and that's all I was really interested in. And so that, that really be- it kinda set a trajectory of my life that wasn't really that great. And, uh, and then I ended up diagnosing that everybody in my family got divorced because they [00:07:00] got married young. And so s- if I could make it till I'm 28 then then I won't have that problem like everybody else had, you know?

Wa- Way to

Scott Maderer: diagnose a non-existent problem.

David Savage: Oh it is. And I, and I look back how naive and how foolish I was because-

Scott Maderer: How, how old were you about that when you thought that?

David Savage: Tw- uh, I was about 23, 24 when I- Okay, okay ... you know, when I made this conclusion.

Scott Maderer: So in fi- in five years you were gonna be magically- Yeah

So much more mature.

David Savage: Somehow I would, I would mature w- without having any experience- Without actually doing anything ... you know, in relationships, you know, of actually working on, you know, having what marriage is, is, is, is a lifelong series of compromises, you know? And so, uh, so I met this this young woman from Mexico City who was from an affluent family through a radio station in Austin.

We won a contest to, to go to Australia together and New Zealand. And, and then she kinda badgered me into, like, "Well, let- let's, you know, w- we've been together [00:08:00] here for a while, let's get married." And I... So I'd gotten married in, in 1988 when I was 28. And It was just the wrong person. And so we had two children, and then we ended up getting divorced in 2000 12 years later.

And I I was completely surprised by it. I would've done anything to work and h- try to resolve whatever issues we had to try to save that marriage. But I, I don't really know what her motives or circumstances were, but we were unequally yoked 'cause when, once we had children, it really, really brought me back to my faith, you know.

And I went on this, uh, walk to Emmaus- Hmm ... in 1994, and it was a real significant event in my life. And I and it was right after my two children had been born. They were born in '90 and '91. And I said, " I wanna be the best dad I can possibly be," and, you know, and so I never wanna get divorced. I wanna, I [00:09:00] had very idealistic. And, uh, so then the divorce was like a real, you know, another decimating, you know, situation. And so I had to properly diagnose myself the second time. And I remarried in, uh, 2002 to this wonderful woman, Kimberly, who's my wife now, and we've been married, uh, 24 years.

Congratulations. And so, uh, that, that's really I, if I'm talking to your audience, you know, you talk about stewardship, you know, and you're talking about it, it's not just financial, it's just how you manage- Yeah ... your resources and your family. It just make good decisions, you know, in the beginning. And what I realized I didn't really have any advice on marriage from my dad, and I didn't understand that, why I never got any advice actually until I thought deeper about it and I realized that my dad's father died when he was 12, and he d- he didn't have any, you know, from his dad, and so maybe he felt ill-equipped.

But, so I did a lot of, uh, self-examination, and that's, that's what I would really recommend to your audience is like, look, you gotta [00:10:00] do the work and, or you're gonna repeat your mistakes. And so, you know, happily married now 24 years. You know, had a great career. You know, never had any problem work-wise or anything else like that or f- or financially I've been pretty successful and, and haven't had a lot of stress over that.

But, uh, so that's how I got to where I am here is, uh learning that the most important decision in your life is who you choose for your mate. And, uh, and you can't kid yourself into thinking that you don't need one or that you don't want one 'cause this is the way God made us. And that was my conclusion once I, uh evaluated myself and what my contribution was, you know, for the divorce and how we probably shouldn't have been married in the first place.

But I was passive, and I kinda went along, and so, uh- Hmm ... so that's, that, that's a little thumbnail there.

Scott Maderer: So talk a little bit, you know, you mentioned in there your, your faith journey a little bit and touched on that. But I, I like [00:11:00] to give people a chance to expand on this, because I feel like our, our faith journey and our life journey a lot of times are intertwined.

A- as we move in, into and out of different phases of our life, it affects our faith. And as we move in and out of different phases of our faith, it affects our life. You know, there, there's a feedback loop between those. So for you, how have you seen the journey that you've been on through your life affect your faith and vice versa?

David Savage: Certainly my faith has been a, a large part of my life because, you know, and this, this is why I wrote the book. It's called The Savage Path because I'm a lifelong backpacker. And so the metaphor is, look I'm backpack- I'm on some journey, let's just call it the quest for authentic manhood and to be more Christ-like before, you know, I enter heaven.

And, uh if I were to be obedient and live in God's will, then I would be on a [00:12:00] smooth, even grade, gradual slope path. But what happens is we start thinking, "Well, we can, we don't need God. We can start, you know, making our own decisions," and we start to squeeze God out. And, uh, we don't realize that when we're having successes it's largely because of him and it's because of the gifts that he's given us.

And when things are going good, you you tend to be full of pride, and that's been something I've probably my largest of the seven deadly sins. Pride, you know, is probably the one that I'm still struggling with every day because I like to think that I did these things. And so, but I always, you know, had that hole in your heart, you know, that longing to I, I think of, of being in in, in your purpose.

And I don't know if you've ever been, uh, hunting with a bird dog. Have you?

Scott Maderer: Not really, no. I- I've been around when people are hunting with a bird dog, but it wasn't, I wasn't kind of involved in the hunt, so to speak.

David Savage: But if you've s- if you've ever been hunting with a [00:13:00] bird dog, and I had a chance to do that a lot with the, in corporate sales, you know, on these hunts with, for pheasant and quail and dove.

And, and a bird dog is, has been bred for many generations to hone this instinct that he has that he can't even control, but he wants to go chase birds, and that's all he lives for. And they're so excited when they get the chance to actually go and hunt the birds. And they're just so in their purpose.

And I was like, man, I wanna be Like a bird dog. You know, I want, I want to know what my purpose is, and I need to get that from God so that then things become easier for you. You know-

You watch, uh, professional athletes or anybody that's just so good at something and you're like, "Wow, look at how Scottie Scheffler hits a golf ball."

It just looks so natural and easy for him. And other people, you know, they just go grind and hit 1,000 golf... You know, it's... And in the United States, you know, we have this [00:14:00] mantra of rugged individualism and, you know, you can just work hard and you just... I don't think you... If you have to work that hard at what you're doing, you're probably not doing what God wired you to do.

And so a lot of my faith journey has been asking God Please reveal your will to me. I know what, what gifts I have, but I want to be obedient to your will." But I just I don't really have a way of discerning it clearly unless you're just really in prayer. And even daily, you know, saying, "Okay, thy will not my will."

And so that's hard to do when you're trying... You're kind of a Type A personality, used to managing things yourself. And then, uh, we joined a Baptist church, and, uh, I, I really liked it and was a Bible study teacher. And then, you know, Kim and I have been deeply involved in our faith. And to me, that's why I'm where I'm at today totally.

[00:15:00] Because through that church, you know, I became a deacon. I went to Israel with a pastor. I got rededicated and baptized in the Jordan River. We w- we hosted Chinese exchange students, and then I went to Chengdu, China, you know, to visit those people. We had a, a trip to Normandy where we were talking about God doesn't want a Dunkirk church of retreat.

He wants a Normandy church of advance. And you know what? It's gonna cost us something. And, uh, there's a lot of people that are all into the Left Behind series and, oh, you know, we're counting how many popes there are and how many blood moons and all this. Oh, I, I know that the end is, like, really close, so maybe I don't have to do anything and I can just sit here and get beamed up.

That's not what God wants, and we won't know the time. And so I need to be active in my faith. And, you know, I- as a new member counselor, every Sunday for 16 years, I walked up when someone else came forward to accept Christ, and [00:16:00] I new member counseled them, and that just really reinforced me.

And uh, my faith is a huge part of my life now, and of course, that's why I'm doing the podcast.

Scott Maderer: So talk a little bit about, The book. You mentioned the book there, The Savage Path. Where did that y- y- you mentioned you were a backpacker, and that's kind of where the title and the, the analogy came from.

But what, uh, what called you to write a book? What made you decide that you should put pen to paper and, and tell a story?

David Savage: Well, the genesis of that idea was, you know, uh, okay, so I was an Eagle Scout. I got my Eagle Scout at 15. I got all three of the, my palms, and then I was like, "Man, I've kinda done it all."

Got interested in girls, as I, you know, started a high adventure coed Explorer post, and then became president of the Ex- Explorer Presidents Association. And then I worked at council camp as a, When I was young, I taught rowing, canoeing, [00:17:00] lifesaving, and swimming on the waterfront for a couple years.

And then I was even a backpacking guide at Philmont. You know, I was a ranger at Philmont actually the year I graduated from A&M 'cause I wanted to go do that. So I had this tremendous scouting background and experience with wonderful adult leaders, and learned so many things from all the different merit badges that I studied.

And in fact, the very last merit badge that I earned was Engineering merit badge, and that's what helped me determine what, you know, my major was going to be. So over my adult life, I'm still, you know, I'm, I'm giving money to Friends of Scouting, I'm helping scouting, I'm, you know, I'm buying popcorn and, you know, what- whatever you need to do to support them.

And I see that they're getting litigated over and over again. Rick Perry, who was governor at the time, wrote a book, On My Honor. He grew up not far from me, Paint Rock, Texas, you know, and I'm from San Angelo. And he donated the proceeds of that book to the legal fight through the Supreme Court, and they...

You know, so basically I'm just [00:18:00] watching what I perceive as evil, you know, trying to tear down one of the best youth organizations to develop young men. Because, you know, the, the oath says, "On my honor, I will do my duty to God and my country, to help other people at all times, to keep myself physically strong, mentally awake, and morally straight."

W- I mean, why would anyone be against that? Except they wanted to allow homosexual scoutmasters in, and then that, that happened. And I'm not saying that's all bad, except that then that created the next series of lawsuits, which were sexual assault cases, and then... So the Boy Scouts of America no longer exist as I knew it, and I was very, very angry about it.

And this was also in my real political involvement stage of my life. And so I, I said, "You know what? These presidential elections and, you know, the demographics and the way people are voting I think that, uh, there aren't 51% of the United States of [00:19:00] America people voting that think like I do, so I'm kind of wasting my time in all this political process.

And the Jews in the diaspora were punished for their, you know, their lack of discipline and their unfaithfulness. But what they did is they wrote something down, you know, called the Bible. And I said, "I need to write down my experience and my history and everything through my scouting so that, you know, maybe in a couple hundred years they'll be wondering, what was this thing called BSA, and how did it work?"

And so that, that was just kind of the kernel or the genesis of the idea was to capture my scouting experiences in the form of this memoir, and also have it help young men because I'm... In my remarriage, I have two stepsons. Their father was an alcoholic. He died in 2005 of cirrhosis, and then they've struggled a little bit with some different substance abuse issues.

And so I had this real soft spot in my heart to try to help young men, too. So those convergence of, uh, those two motives, you know, of wanting to [00:20:00] kind of record scouting and then help young men is the genesis of the book.

Scott Maderer: So talk a little bit, the other thing you mentioned as you were kind of sharing your, your journey and your, your faith journey was you used the word pride a couple of different times.

Mm. Mm-hmm. Um and I know from other conversations we've had that, you know that, you said it for you at least has been kind of that, "I'm gonna fix it all. I'm gonna go out and do it." Right. "I'm gonna make it right." you even mentioned that a little bit with the book and you know- Mm-hmm ... the politics and all of that.

How do you think pride as a sin, as a a way of thinking kind of helps or hurts rather... I think a lot of times we have the right spirit. You know, we, we want the good result.

David Savage: Right.

Scott Maderer: Um, and we wanna try to help, and we wanna try to fix things. And, and all of that's good. And yet [00:21:00] pride comes in, and it a lot of times makes those helps, those helping things go wrong, you know, so to speak.

Yes. How, how have you seen that play out for you, and, and what have you learned from paying attention to that?

David Savage: You know, Scott, that is a fascinating question because I think today it's more insidious than ever because flattery, you know, is used to sell people, but it's also used to con many, many people.

You know, like, so you can get invited to be in Who's Who, and you're like, "Wow, I'll be in Who's Who." Well, who cares? Who looks at Who's Who? I don't know that it matters or anything, but there's all kinds of schemes and scams and things that prey upon your ego and your pride, and I think they're more insidious and harder to discern today than they've ever been.

But for me, you know, again, going back to here I am, son of an Air Force master sergeant Eagle Scout. I mean, I'm all about God and [00:22:00] country. I'm super patriotic, you know. I'm coming of age. Uh, Reagan is president, and I'm like, "Yes," you know? I'm, you know, we won the Cold War. And so- Always toyed with politics.

In 1984, I actually applied for a White House fellowship, you know, in the Reagan administration. I had been, uh, recruited to run for city council early, you know, in my 20s and when I was living in Austin as a consultant there. And so you have people that come to you and they, they recognize that you have some ability.

You know, I was really good in Toastmasters and public speaking, and I was representing all my clients at these public meetings, you know, when land development was really booming in Austin. And so, you know, I would have to go basically fight, you know, in these public meetings with the colonized hippies, you know, who didn't want Austin to grow and keep it weird and were trying to basically obstruct everything instead of trying to cooperate and grow the city together.

And, and so I was pretty effective in, at these meetings and people were like, [00:23:00] "Hey, we'll get this guy to stand up there and take all the fiery darts," you know? And it's always the big money's kind of behind him. And so I would say from 2008 I was a, I got elected to be a delegate to the National Republican Convention.

And then in 2024, I sought for and became elected a delegate to the Republican National Convention again. So for 16 years, I was really gonna make the difference myself. And it it was really right-minded cause I really want, love America, I wanna preserve what the America I grew up in. But it, there was also a lot of pride in that.

And so you're talking about stewardship, your time, your talent, and your treasure, and I spent a tremendous amount of all three of those in this 16-year period with almost nothing to show for it. Yeah. And, uh, it's so [00:24:00] exasperating. And it just is, it's like throwing red meat in a, you know, a pit full of tigers, you know.

And, and it's just... And, and the infighting. The infighting with... You know, 'cause neither party, you know, is very appealing, I don't think, to anybody these days. And so you're like, "Well, you know, I kinda have a Christian worldview, so I have this party." And then you have a humanist worldview, I think is more represented by the other party.

But the primary system is what's wrong because you have to be extreme, you know, to win your primary. And then a moderate who would probably be the best person to serve all the people, you know, so you got the 20% on each fringe screaming and, you know, that's where the money and everything. So the 60% in the middle don't get represented and so I finally, uh, after the 2024 convention, uh, and I think I've, I haven't mentioned, but I, you know, I'm, I'm appointed, I was appointed to, by Governor Abbott to be on the board of directors of the Brazos River Authority, which is a political appointment.

But not so political, where I could really [00:25:00] serve with what my skills are, and I enjoyed that. But I've just withdrawn from everything. I'm not, like, not voting, but I just realized that it was consuming too much of me, and I w- I should've been devoting more of my time, talent, and treasures to church, to mission, to my stepsons who are struggling with things, uh, you know, to r- just finishing raising my kids.

And so don't get that time back but I'm not gonna be continue in my foolishness and be- ... you know, subject to pride so much because it's that flattery. You know, even when I retired, you know, I I retired for the right reasons. My mom was in memory care, my brother was in a VA home with alcoholic dementia, and I, I was over both of their affairs.

And I retired at the end of 2018 because I knew they were both kinda heading toward the end. And my mom died in January of 2019, and my brother died six weeks later in February of 2019, and I had to manage, you know the closing of their [00:26:00] estates and everything. It was really tough And so I had, I was 58, had ended a 31-year very successful career in the energy business, you know, as a, as a global executive.

And then I'm like, "Man now I'm not having to take care of all their stuff. What am I gonna do?" And, uh, I hadn't even thought about it much, but it was, it was about this time of year the, uh, AFPM, the American Fuel and Petrochemical Manufacturers Association, was an organization that I was the face of my company, Nalco, for 25 years, and I wasn't at that conference.

And then they were like, "Well, where's David?" 'Cause a lot of people been trying to recruit me, and I liked the pension, the, the lump sum option that I had with the company. And so I said, "No, I'm, I'm, I'm loyal." when I wasn't there the, my company cohort said, "He's retired," you know? "He, he's no longer with us."

The next week I got four unsolicited job offers, [00:27:00] Scott. That all were offering me more money than I was making you know, when I retired, and I was like... And I accepted one, you know, without even really thinking about it, because I got kind of flattered into it. You know, "We need you. You're the only guy who can do this," and you know, and I was just like, just there was only one guy between me and the CEO, and I didn't like the CEO.

And so I, I worked for that company for a year, and then the pandemic happened, and I was like, "Look, this guy..." You know, so I resigned, but again, that cost me my health, my retiree healthcare benefits, you know, from my 31-year career and, you know, so there was some, some pain because of, of, I, I, I got flattered into it, you know?

And, and it wasn't, it's never really the way it's presented to you and, and you, you always have to guard against, uh, pride. Pride is a problem. Mm-hmm.

Scott Maderer: Well, I think part of that, too, a- and it's, you know, I, I've seen this, [00:28:00] A, a lot of times if you really sit down with somebody, people agree about what they want.

You know we want people to be taken care of, we want people to be treated with dignity. We, you know, we want z- z- people t- we want things to be successful, we want growth, we want, you know. That you you, you, you hear all these buzzwords that people will agree that they want, but then what we yell at each other about is how we get there.

Yes. You know? Yes, that's exactly right. Yeah. You know. And it's like it's... So a- and I think the how we get there part a lot of times is where the pride steps in. 'Cause it's, " I know how we get there. You know, I know what the right way is." Yes. I mean and a lot of times we pull God into it too.

It's like- Oh, yes ... you know, you know, I know what we, I know what God wants for us to do. And it's like-

David Savage: God's on our side. Yes,

Scott Maderer: for sure ... you know, Go- God's on my side. God's on your side. God's on my side. And, a- a- and [00:29:00] again, you see this in wars, you see this, and it's not even just America either. This is not you know, I think, I think we've done it- on a rather, on a large stage at times.

But, uh, but it, you know, I see it in other places in other ways too. This corruption or, or anger over the how, when the reality is we agree on the what, a- and I, for me at least, I see pride step into that so often. Is that kind of what you're talking about wrestling with, is that feeling of, you know, how do we get there and I must, I must be right, so to speak?

David Savage: We, certainly. Uh, because, you know, the the tagline of my show, and we might say this again later, but you know, my, my podcast is called Wrestling With the Inner Man because it is such a- Yeah ... an illustration of the human condition. You know, I think of the you [00:30:00] know, the old Animal House where, you know, John Belushi has a little angel on this shoulder, and then he has a little devil on this shoulder, and that's what's happening inside of our head.

We've got voices, and our struggle begins every day with the same fight. You know, am I gonna listen to my selfish, sinful nature, or am I gonna listen to my Holy Spirit-inspired divine nature? And you have those debates in your head all the time. And I'd like to say we win more, you know, for the Holy Spirit and divine n- but it's not really that's probably not a winning record, you know, for most of us.

But then, you know, it's just how quickly we recognize the cycle and say, "Oh, all right, I gotta correct, I gotta go back, I gotta do, you know, things the way I'm supposed to do," or, "I learned a lesson. Ow that's gonna leave a mark," you know? And then- And then you learn, you know, through that over time, and, and that's how you grow in wisdom.

Hopefully you grow in wisdom, you know, from your experiences. And so, [00:31:00] but you're right, I think people on both sides of the political aisle have, uh, wonderful aspirational thoughts, and then it's just like, " put me in charge and I can manage everything," or Hey, I don't want my individual liberties, you know, trampled upon."

And so, I mean, just look at maybe something that's not so divisive, but after 9/11, you know, the permissions, you know, that we gave the government to essentially spy on us and get our cell phone records and everything else is, can never be reeled back in, and you know, you just have to be careful about how much government you want in your life I guess is my, that's kind of where I, I sit.

And, uh, and I'm just gonna try to be out there and do what's best for my fellow man and myself. And, you know, I, and I, and there's no better place. There's, there's a lot to be griping about in the United States today. There's still no better country, you know, in the world that I wanna [00:32:00] go immigrate to. I don't know about you, Scott.

Scott Maderer: So what, what have you found, for you at least, what does submission look like when you talk about submitting to God?

David Savage: Man, that's a good question. So it's just to surrender. It's really a more devoted prayer life. It's-- Look I have always read daily devotionals. My- like I said, my mom was so influential.

She, uh, she got me Guideposts, you know, the daily devotionals in the book form back in, like, the '80s, and I've been reading that as a daily devotional ever since. I also read Better Man, which puts out a daily devotional that's really s- targeted toward men. And then there's been a variety. You know, John Maxwell, you said, you said, you know, he had a great book on devotionals, and so I'm always trying to begin my day, you know, with, with a, a scripture.

And then my prayer is pretty consistent. You know, it's like, "Lord, help me [00:33:00] discern your will and then help me be obedient to it." That's what I want. I just, I wanna know what your will is. It's hard for me to know what that is, and so I have to stop my own plans and s- and ask. And I'm a lot better at it today than I used to be.

I, I never would've been able to just in this whole podcast endeavor, and writing a book, and everything else, to just go, "Okay, you know, I don't know who my next guest is gonna be, but I'm not gonna sweat it, 'cause God's gonna put somebody like Scott Maderer in my path at PodFest, and I'm gonna trust that."

It's really, what can you trust? And it, and the more you trust God, the more your cup gets filled. Yeah. And so I've experienced that, and I think, uh, stewardship is like that. When you... You know, and I've always, I've been a tither since 2000, you know, since my s- my second marriage, you know, and because she agrees with it.

And then the blessings have just been truly overflowing. My career, you know, I... You know, of course, divorce is financially [00:34:00] devastating, and, uh, you know, I got kinda raked over the coals on the first one. But then my financial success in my career after that was just c- I could never even have imagined.

And so I think that, you know, what, when you begin to build that record of, uh, alright, you gotta surrender. And it was hardest on, on these political things, you know, where I was just like, "Golly, man, I just I, I just, I'm not gonna be able to change the country, and I'm just gonna have to quit watching the news, quit fretting about it, quit, you know, writing emails and sharing, and, you know."

It's just like social media's a, a very poor place to try to-- No one's gonna change their mind off of social media posts. They just insult one another But if you and I could sit down and have a dialogue, man, then to be a statesman like, you know, or a diplomat and be open to the other ideas of people, [00:35:00] I've always liked doing that because I just find people are interesting and I like...

You know, and you and I discussed this previously. You know, it's just, I'm curious, you know, how he- Mm-hmm ... arrived at that worldview or whatever you wanna call it.

Scott Maderer: Well, and I think that comes down to it and kind of putting these two ideas together, pride and submission, and I think I'm gonna, I'm gonna put words in your mouth, and you, you feel free to throw these back at me-

and say, "Oh, that's not what I'm saying." it, you know, it comes down to when we get humble enough to go, "Maybe I'm wrong," you know? Right. I'm listening to God. I believe I know what God is telling me to do. But maybe I'm wrong. Let me make sure. Let me double-check. Let me ask more questions.

Let me get to know other people, you know, and understand where they're coming from and what their view is, and well, they're a child of God, too. So, you know, it's a, let me [00:36:00] engage with that. And that humility, I think, is a lot of times for uh, especially for men, but I think for all of us, that is the antidote to the pride.

And boy, I don't know about you, but that's, that one's a tough one. You know, because, you know, I know I'm right. Why, why do I have to be humble? I mean...

David Savage: Well, you know, that's, that's so true. It's so funny. But what... I, I'll give you a terrific illustration. So here I, I get bumped up from North America-wide position to a global position, and you know, we got ISIS going on, and they're, like, beheading people.

And I told you, when you watch that on the news, and that's, you know, you've never been to the Middle East, you know, and been in these countries and stuff. And you're like, "Oh, hey, David, we need you to go to the Sadara facility in Saudi Arabia," or, "We need you to go to Qatar or Kuwait," and you know, and I'm I'm starting to have to go to the Middle East and, and, uh, and I get my passport and, you know, and I've traveled [00:37:00] outside, but man, you know, I, I was I had, like, a little kit, you know, for my bug out bag and everything.

I was just like, "I'll tell you what. If somebody comes and tries to throw a, a hood over my head, it's the fight to the death right there because I'm not gonna be, you know, captured and tortured and everything else. It's, it's like I'm, I'm gonna die trying to escape." And you know, and I, I had all kinds of fantasy thoughts about it.

And so I fly over there, and of course I'm, I'm a senior level manager, first of all, and you've got people that are working for you in these countries. They're the most wonderful people.

And they don't fit anything of your stereotype. Any

Scott Maderer: of the

David Savage: molds that you have in your head, yeah. What- whatsoever.

Whatsoever. And they're wonderful hosts. So I fly into Bahrain, and then my local guy takes me to this wonderful restaurant, and we're in Manama and, you know, he goes, "Look, we're gonna drive across the causeway to Saudi Arabia instead of, uh flying in. You know, you could get cavity searched on your first trip and everything."

[00:38:00] And I had to actually have a separate passport because I'd been to Israel. But then I go into Saudi Arabia. I was l- I was kinda hazed a little bit at the border, but just, it's just a reminder, "Hey, you're not in control here, man." And that was something that I needed to experience. You know, I was kind of forced into humility.

I was getting pissed 'cause I was, they were, there was nobody else there, and they just made me wait for 30 minutes, you know- Mm-hmm ... while they drank coffee and just kinda watched me.

Scott Maderer: I- Oh, they wanted to make sure that you knew-

David Savage: Yeah ...

Scott Maderer: that you weren't in control.

David Savage: Man, that's exactly right. I, I was telling my guy, "Man, I'll walk back across that causeway.

I don't give a..." I'm here to help their company make money." You know, so y- of course you don't say any of that stuff, and you're, you're just quiet. And then, so we go on, and then I'm, I meet our customers and, you know, they're, all of their tradition is about you, you can't discuss bus- You know, y- you know, you think about it, you're in a nomadic country where, you know, you traveled by camel across the desert, you know, and the first thing, you know, when you finally make it to a [00:39:00] safe place or oasis or whatever is like, man, it's hospitality.

It's like- Hospitality first ... you know, you need to be Hey, do you need something to eat? Do you need something to drink? Sit down here. Let's, how's your family and all..." You know, you don't talk business for a long time. I, everything that I had as a stereotype of what my experience might be like based upon the fear culture of what the US news media puts out and what I actually experienced was totally wrong.

And when you're proven wrong on one thing like that, then you start guessing, like, "I could be wrong. I could be wrong on more stuff." Yeah. And then you learn to keep your mouth shut and s- and then just kind of learn a little bit more a- and realize that you don't know everything.

Scott Maderer: Yeah. I think every American especially, and, and this one I will put on America I, it, I think one of our downfalls is the sheer size of our country and the fact that so many of us have never left America.

David Savage: Right.

Scott Maderer: And it again, wonderful country. We could experience almost anything you [00:40:00] want and never leave the border, pe-

People laugh and, and, you know, they come over from Great Britain and they're like, "Why don't y'all vacation in other countries?" And it's Look," you know?

It's like- Right ... "This is why." But, and, and that's a beautiful thing, but it's also a big downfall because I'm the same way, but for me it was South America where- Mm-hmm ... you know, I travel pretty extensively in Central and South America. And you hear a picture, and then you go down there and go Wait a minute.

This isn't what they told me I was going to experience. This is a very different different culture- Right ... different people. Uh, but beautiful. You know, some of the nicest people I've ever met on the planet. Right, right. And, you know, and that- Most pe- most

David Savage: people are just wonderful. It's the politicians that represent- They, well, it- No one likes the way that they're running their governments, you

Scott Maderer: know?

Because it's very easy if we can make you hate something, then you don't pay attention to what we're doing.

You know what I mean? That, that's it. Yes, yes. If I, if I can make you hate a them, and you're at [00:41:00] us, whoever us it... By the way, and this is not right wing, left wing, this is, it's churches do this, religions do it- Yes

politicians do it, companies do it. You know, if we can make somebody the enemy, then you're gonna ignore whatever we're talking about and whatever we're doing because, you know, we're us. Right. So I've got a, a few questions that I like to ask all of my guests, but before I go there, is there anything else about the work you do, your podcast, your book, that you'd like to share?

David Savage: No. I think, you know, for your listeners, i- if any of what I've talked about is, is mildly interesting that would drive you to be a little more curious, I, I have a terrific website and it's just www.thesavagepath.com. The podcast and the book and everything else is, is there, and then there's a, I put out a once-a-month newsletter and, uh, kind of summarizes the podcast for the month.

And you know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't abuse anybody's email if they want to sign up. [00:42:00] So that's it. You know, if you wanna learn more, I'd love to connect and, uh, you know, uh, continue to offer the wisdom that I'm mining out of others as guests on my show.

Scott Maderer: So my brand is Inspired Stewardship, and you've referenced stewardship s- a few times as we've gone through the episode.

But I also know stewardship is one of those words that can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people. So for you, what does the word stewardship mean to you?

David Savage: Stewardship to me means, uh, taking care of what God has given me. That could be people, it could be pets, it could be, uh, a profession.

It could be my church community. But everything, a- as a man, you know, I think that, uh, John Eldredge said, you know, every man needs three things. You know, he needs a will to obey, a work to do, and a woman to love. And so the work and the will are taking care of it, and also taking care of your woman.

And [00:43:00] so that's what I think of as stewardship, is how well do you take care of, uh, your family so that they feel safe, they feel secure, they feel loved and that you're consistent. You know, you're not Just completely different, you know, from one day to the next. And, uh, so that that's my definition, is just, uh, caring for what God's given me, and then growing it too, like in the parable of the talents.

Scott Maderer: This is my favorite question that I like to ask everybody. I- imagine for a moment I could invent this magic machine, and with this machine I was able to take you from where you are today and transport you into the future maybe 250, maybe 150, maybe 250 years. And through the power of this machine, you are able to look back and see all of the ripples, all of the connections, all of the impacts you've left.

What [00:44:00] impact do you hope you've had in the world?

David Savage: Wow, that's a big question. But I have thought about it before. I am in this Better- Better Man organization, you know, and in 2005 I went through the men's fraternity program, and at that time it was a 26-week course. And the end of the course you had to write a, uh, personal manhood plan.

So in 2005, I wrote a personal manhood plan, and I've actually tried to adhere to it. Now, again, this is a, a trajectory you're saying out, you know, a couple hundred years what's our legacy? You know, what's my impact? But I, I, I w- wrote two things down. Said, "I wanted to be a standard-bearer for my children and grandchildren, leaving a legacy for generations to come of a life lived according to truth and a biblical definition of manhood."

So the biblical definition of manhood I took from Robert Lewis, and that's what I used in my house, and my kids know this for [00:45:00] sure. It's like you reject passivity, you accept responsibility, you lead courageously, and you live your life for the greater reward. So if I could live that life and that would leave a legacy on my heirs and descendants, uh, that would be great.

I, I had a, a quote here. Maya Angelou, the famous poet, wrote, "I think a hero is any person really intent on making this a better place for all people." And I really have. I've tried. I don't know how much I've done in all of my endeavors, but that has been my intent, like we were talking about. You know, the, the goal is, is, is good.

Now, maybe I don't know the best way to, to get there. But and then the corollary to that quote- Is, uh, the one I think Thomas Burke said, "Evil prevails in the world when good men do nothing." So I'm not gonna do nothing. We have to take action. That's why I've written a book, that's why I'm doing the podcast.

And then, uh, you know, I said I wanna pass on to my children the two greatest passions in my [00:46:00] life, which are my love for personal relationship with Jesus Christ, and the awe and wonder I've always had for His creation. 'Cause I love being outdoors. I... That's why I backpacked my whole life and I have a Airstream, you know, now.

And we just... His creation is where my batteries are recharged, and that's how I get regenerated. And then I, you know, I said I wanted to help keep my community, my state, my nation strong and free. Well, you gotta participate. You can't be one of those good men who does nothing. So I wanna promote conservative principles of free enterprise, limited government, individual freedom, traditional American values, and a strong national defense, taken right from The Heritage Foundation, you know.

So those were the things that that I wrote in my looking ahead statement, and then I even wrote an epitaph. You know, I said what would I want, you know, on my tombstone? H- David was a godly man, consistent with his values, true to himself and his family and his friends throughout his life. He was a patriot, proud of his [00:47:00] country and the principles it was founded upon.

He was a man who always loved to laugh and make others laugh. That's real important to me. He was a man who never lost his sense of awe for creation and nature, and enjoyed sharing it with others, and he was a friend that could be counted on

Scott Maderer: So what's coming next for you? What, what's on the roadmap as you continue through your journey?

David Savage: So I'm delighted that I have kind of, uh, discarded a lot of my, you know, political things. Uh, I was up for reappointment to the board, and I, I actually withdrew that from the governor's appointment office. They were kind of surprised at that. And I said, "No, yeah, c- I do enjoy it, and I like the title, and I have this real nice jacket that says Director of Board," you know, on the Brazos River Authority.

And, and, but again, that's where I get, getting kind of drawn away from my purpose. I wanna be like that bird dog, and I think God has given me this purpose is this podcast that I'm doing, Wrestling with the Inner Man. And so I've been doing it since June 6th, D-Day. You [00:48:00] know, is the anniversary of D-Day of 2021.

And, uh, started as a radio program, and then, uh, and a podcast, and I dropped the radio portion. And so I wrote the book, and then I learned, hey, nobody makes any money selling books. And, and, uh it, it gives you a platform, you know, to speak. And so I'm just trying to help others. I really... I had kind of wrestled with the fact that whether I wanted to do a nonprofit or not, because if I wanna talk about political things, I didn't wanna be limited, and you can't do that as a nonprofit.

And so, uh, that was another step of a maturity for me where I said, "Okay, I'm gonna drop, I'm gonna drop that off. I'm gonna form a nonprofit." And I'm all in for others. There's really nothing in this for me other than being happy like that bird dog when I get to go chase some birds, you know?

And, and if I, if I'm using my gifts and my talents, you know, in the in the twilight of my life and my sage stage where I can pass wisdom along, [00:49:00] because again, I go back to my two stepsons who are still struggling. They're gonna be 38 and 40 years old this year, and there's a whole bunch of guys out there like them that grew up without a present father you know, or was an alcoholic or a workaholic or the single parent home or...

And they're rudderless out there, and they're in a boat that doesn't have any ballast 'cause they didn't have a dad who filled it so that it's like, "Hey, I'm gonna put ballast in your boat so a little wave doesn't tip you over." Unfortunately, there's a lot of people out there where a little wave tips their boat over, and they can't seem to recover.

And I-- That's my mission. That's my mission. If I can help people do that of any kind, a- anywhere in the world, man, that's what I'm trying to do.

Scott Maderer: So you can find out more about David Savage over at thesavagepath.com. Of course, I'll have a link to that over in the show notes as well. David, what else would you like to make sure that you share with the listener?

David Savage: I write a lot of [00:50:00] poems, and so I thought I'd end with a poem that I wrote. It's actually in the back of my book and it's, it's about the parable of the sower. The cause there are seeds, you know, th- and I think it relates well to, you know, what your mission is, is stewardship.

You know, it, some seed falls, you know, on hard ground and nothing happens with it, and some it grows and it sprouts and then, you know, it doesn't get enough water, it's shallow soil or, and then some is choked out by thorns. And then the good seed, though, can produce, you know, 1,000 times, and that's what, you know, we're all striving for.

But this poem is called, uh, Good Seed Choked Out By Thorns. And, I am back in West Texas, feeling closer to my roots, where shafts of sunlight pierce the clouds like a searchlight on the butte. At dusk, it's still and quiet, only insects chirping low as I strain to hear the still, small voice, His will for me [00:51:00] to know.

In the din of the city with its lusts, deceits, and fears, I am lost and feel quite distant from the one I should be near. I don't want to be the seed choked out by all the thorns, succumbing to the evil one whose schemes against I'm warned. The troubles of this world, like fiery darts against me fly, the shield of faith my only hope in thwarting all his lies.

I long to go on offense, taking back the ground I've lost, but a single soldier army, like a cork at sea, is tossed. Lord, please help me remember it's your grace and not my will that unleashes heavenly power and provides us with the skill to stand against the devil and to bear the fruit you planned, to cling to your true message and bring healing to our land.

Scott Maderer: Amen. Thank you.[00:52:00]

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