Episode 1350: Interview with Artist and Humanist Michaell Magrutsche

[00:00:00] Scott Maderer: Thanks for joining us on episode 1, 350 of the Inspired Stewardship Podcast.

[00:00:06] Michaell Magrutsche: My name is Michael Magrutsche. Do you agree that our existence is the proof that we are worthy?

[00:00:24] Art is always the leader. Art creation is always the leader of what's humanly possible. Either you see an idea on a stage, uh, there is an interaction between two people and say, you know what, and it enlightens you. And so we have art to, A, as a communication language, and then art creation is also, and art is a blueprint for what's humanly possible.

[00:00:46] Scott Maderer: Welcome and thank you for joining us on the Inspired Stewardship Podcast. If you truly desire to become the person who God wants you to be, then you must learn to use your time, your talent, and your treasures for your [00:01:00] true calling. In the Inspired Stewardship Podcast, you will learn to invest in yourself.

[00:01:05] Invest in others and develop your influence so that you can impact the world.

[00:01:19] In today's podcast episode, I interview Michael Magarosh. I ask Michael about his work as an artist, and I also ask him to share how his faith became part of his journey and where we can find it even if, or maybe especially if, we struggle. I've got a new book coming out.

[00:01:43] called Inspired Living, assembling the puzzle of your call by mastering your time, your talent, and your treasures. You can find out more about it and sign up for getting more information over at InspiredStewardship. com Inspired Living. That's InspiredStewardship. com Inspired Living.[00:02:00]

[00:02:04] Michael is an Austrian Californian multimedia artist. He became a creativity awareness educator through his experience based outside the box upbringing that he was forced into through his neurodiversity. He's a self taught author of five books, a podcaster, a speaker, a guide, and more. His podcast is called The Smart of Art.

[00:02:29] He separates each problem and solution in human and systems relevancy, which allows all participants to become aware and align their needs. Without creativity, there are no man made systems. There would be no world as we know it. And he discovered that there are three inherent human superpowers that we should all be aware of creativity, healthy dialogue, and adaptability.

[00:02:54] Welcome to the

[00:02:54] Michaell Magrutsche: show, Michael. Thank you so much for being here, for letting me paint [00:03:00] the picture,

[00:03:00] Scott Maderer: Scott. Absolutely. I'm looking forward to our conversation today. I shared a bit in the intro, but I always like to... let people go behind the intro because when we have an introduction, we talk about our books and our things that we do and all of this, but that doesn't really tell the whole story.

[00:03:19] Would you unpack a little bit more about your journey and why you focus on these areas of creativity and dialogue, adaptability, and you'll focus on humans instead

[00:03:33] Michaell Magrutsche: I was born in Vienna in Austria. I was a sick child. I got to school at seven and I found out that I'm extremely nervous, meaning I have dyslexia with dysgraphia where I can't read my handwriting and I still can't and what that did is I comprehended what was said.

[00:03:56] But I couldn't regurgitate. I couldn't. So if we would [00:04:00] have prepared for this interview, I would have started all around. And I might still start it. So that and so I couldn't literally fit into, I had to literally repeat. Two grades, because in Europe, they don't pull you with you, they just, you you have to repeat and you know how that is when you're like 12, 13 and you're older than them, two or three years older.

[00:04:26] I was never bullied, but I just didn't fit in. It's so many of us humans feel like, oh, my God, everybody's perfect. You're looking at social media and everything. But you were not, they all have a great time without realizing they just make in a photo in their happiest moments. But what are the rest of their moments?

[00:04:48] Scott Maderer: I always tell people Instagram, they forget about the little load of laundry. That's just right out of frame. Dirty clothes that are right out of Perfect metaphor. Yeah. [00:05:00] And it's The fact that I couldn't fit into systems, I had to be human relevant. I had to be my friends, my buddies.

[00:05:12] Michaell Magrutsche: I had to be that because in school I couldn't make friends because I was literally the outcast because I just couldn't catch up. I was diagnosed as dyslexic, but that was it. I still had to read, do all the other stuff that everybody else had to do. So this went on till I was I couldn't repeat any grades anymore.

[00:05:36] So they. Basically school was done for me. System said, okay, we can teach you. You're done. And I got jobs mostly in hospitality. And then got very quickly into leadership because I was good with with humans. And I found out that [00:06:00] the fact that I didn't ha didn't have to fit in the systems didn't make any sense to me till I was 50.

[00:06:08] And literally, I hit the wall till I was 50. All my achievements that are systemically really great, working with Robert Evans, co producing with him, who did The Godfather and Chariton, was City Arch Commissioner. All this stuff was never fulfilling because I thought there's something wrong with me because I can't fit to the tribe, quote, unquote, systems.

[00:06:31] And I found now that it was actually exactly, it put, God puts me where I was supposed to be, right? Nature put me where I supposed to be. And I. Now I have actually systemic value because I've never fit into systems. So I see what it means to be human centric. And I see the difference between [00:07:00] human centric and system relevant.

[00:07:02] And most people I ask them, my question is always. What life do you live? Do you live a human centric life or a system relevant life? And most people don't even know what I mean by that and they because we don't know that we have forgotten that we are part of nature, But we our habitat is in systems in houses and High rises in cities, which is all systems and we have forgotten that so in a lot of ways we still react like nature, like meaning our emotions, our our sex drive, our rage, all this stuff is very natural, but we try to systemically suppress it and not express it and then it comes out in disease and stress.

[00:07:57] In all this stuff, because [00:08:00] we couldn't separate the two. We are in the teeter totter between being a human that works in systems, but systems are more relevant, because without systems, I cannot buy my food. I cannot pay the rent. I cannot get my car. And that, I think, I got that when I was 50. I got that.

[00:08:21] By writing the last book that I did, The Smart of Art, where I said, why are 97 to 99% of artists poor in the world? And I said, I got to dive into that. And then I saw the light went on and literally say, okay, there's an art product that is treated like a commodity like anything in business supply and demand.

[00:08:46] And there's the creation process. And I found, because it saved my life. If it wouldn't save my life, creating art. Because that's the only way where I fit in because it didn't matter what race, what color[00:09:00] what sexuality I am. It didn't matter at all. If gender, nothing mattered. We just, we had to put a a concert on.

[00:09:12] It doesn't matter where you're from. If you can play the flute, I don't care. As long as you play the flute. And and I really, it enlightened me literally that I said we are all focusing always on the product on our relevant system, relevant value, instead of our human centric value, because in nature, you are valuable because you exist.

[00:09:38] Basically, by the sheer fact that you exist, you are valuable. The ant is the ant, does it's job, the elephant does it's job that's it. And we forgot that we forgot that we are worthy by nature because otherwise nature doesn't make mistakes. The fact that we are [00:10:00] born is enough that we are valuable, but it doesn't mean that we have in our systems monopoly game that we are good monopoly players but it, but we are adaptable.

[00:10:12] So we think, okay, the tribe is basically not accepting us. And so we feel self shame not good enough and try to balance it with drugs and everything else just to get through.

[00:10:27] Scott Maderer: But I think a lot of people feel that feeling of not fitting in. In other words, I think there's more people, and I've had the opportunity to talk to some fairly large groups of people and ask them about their inner dialogue and their inner voice and their what they're, what they tell themselves, and even some very highly extreme.

[00:10:49] Quote unquote successful, at least by the measures of the world, people who will tell you how worthless they feel, how they feel like they don't belong, how all of these [00:11:00] sorts of things. So we have that incongruity sometimes between even the people that look like they're playing the game and are winning the game, whatever that game is, don't feel like they're winning.

[00:11:11] Why do you think that conflict exists within

[00:11:14] Michaell Magrutsche: us? Because of one lie that we tell ourselves, we say. I can be exchanged with somebody else and we are not 8 billion, the same 8 billion widgets. We're eight. We are one of 8 billion individuals. So I think there's a big look at that because, and the systems that we created are very limited.

[00:11:42] The hierarchy in a company is the C level doesn't know anything, but the bottom line does. So the per, the guy that works in the in the shoe manufacturing a shoe, if he's not good, gluing the sole on he's gonna get [00:12:00] exchanged like a cog on a wheel. And this is a threat because basically we know unconsciously, we know we are one of one.

[00:12:10] But over generation, systemic living, we got that brand out of it because, so there's two conflicting things. Number one, they have a d n A drive to belong. If we all have, it's like our procreation draft that is from like 15 on till 14 on till 28 I think is DNA draft. Only that stops. The inclusion drive is always here.

[00:12:34] It doesn't stop at 28. What happened is. So we have that. And then at the same time, in order to make 8 billion people live with each other and communicate with that, we have our five, six, I call them six answers because they resonate if you resonate with somebody. And we basically can, with what we have, [00:13:00] like art, I can write a stick figure where you can sing a song that is understood by 8 billion people.

[00:13:07] Unless they're deaf or can't see but 8 billion people, you have all the tools that you can commute with different human beings. And I think the reason why we these drives are conflicted when you go in the system. So you have to say, I'm one of many, if I'm not here, the next CEO is coming or the next shoe, the guy that puts the sole on the shoe.

[00:13:35] They'll replace me

[00:13:36] Scott Maderer: tomorrow.

[00:13:36] Michaell Magrutsche: Exactly. And you want to be part of you want to be part of it. So you're driven through it. And then you have your adaptability and it costs a lot of energy to go from, okay, now I am in my function of school. Then I'm going into religion. Then I go on Sunday church.

[00:13:58] Then I go [00:14:00] and you constantly adapt. You and I that you and I can talk to each other. We have to adapt to each other. We feel each other out and then we start dancing. And and that's in a company structure that is system relevant where it's not about the system is human relevant it's right now currently, but this is going to change right now all over the world that systems have to become human relevant.

[00:14:33] They have to support. Humans like they were intended to do because you cannot submit to to your own creation. It's like the artist creates a statue and then says tell me whom should I go out with this girl or that girl? Or should I buy that stock? Or should I buy that? You can't submit to it.

[00:14:56] It's almost like God comes down and says, Oh, I want to figure [00:15:00] out how humans function. He doesn't need to know that. We don't need to know we need to be, we don't need to get, submit to a sculpture or to a vase that we created. And it seems like that we project that onto Apple computers, being American, being this, being that, being part of this religion, being part of whatever.

[00:15:24] And we're projecting that on where we really all humans in any show, and we're not even gendered. We are gendered. Obviously, we are I see you a man, but I communicate with you from a human aspect. And if there was a woman that was in a different race, I would talk to her the same way.

[00:15:46] I wouldn't talk to a different way because I connect as on a human level. And that helped me a tremendous amount. It

[00:15:53] Scott Maderer: reminds me and bringing into the field. You mentioned music earlier and playing the you would think [00:16:00] normally, right? Okay. Somebody plays the flute. They play it. They would be recruited to play the flute, but they've actually done studies where they do blind.

[00:16:07] Where all they do is hear the person playing, but they can't see the person, so they don't know what sex they are, what race they are, whatever. And they're more, completely different hiring practices happen in symphonies and things because guess what? We have biases that we brought into

[00:16:26] Michaell Magrutsche: it.

[00:16:27] Yeah. Yeah, it's not anymore the practice that you look at the person. It's a common, all of orchestra always behind the curtain. Always. Yeah,

[00:16:35] Scott Maderer: now, but that wasn't always

[00:16:37] Michaell Magrutsche: that way. No, not at all, because there were the nephew of the theater director and all this stuff. There were a lot of nepotism.

[00:16:46] And it is fine. An inherent bias of if they were all male judges. They have particular biases that they bring to the view, regardless of whether they want to or not, they're [00:17:00] going to.

[00:17:00] Yeah. And so they grow up by, by doing this very much. And again, art is always giving us a blueprint of what it is what's humanly possible, right?

[00:17:12] Art is always the leader. Art creation is always the leader of what's humanly possible. Either you see an idea on a stage there is an interaction between two people and say, you know what? And it enlightens you. And so we have art to, A, as a communication language, and then art creation is also an art is a blueprint for what's humanly possible.

[00:17:33] And we totally ignore that. That's why I am only about art creation. So my podcast, all my books, everything is about the creation of art because that's where the human value is. The having the Mona Lisa is a beautiful thing, but doesn't do anything to humanity because it was lifted as the best painting or whatever, or [00:18:00] the most people that relate to it.

[00:18:03] And it has human centric in nothing. Any concert with kids has more impact on on humans than than the Mona Lisa that systemically was endowed. Oh, there's Van Gogh. Van Gogh is great. But everybody can paint today. Everybody can paint like Van Gogh. It's literally you can have a AI machine.

[00:18:26] Yeah, you can

[00:18:26] Scott Maderer: just ask for an AI to give me a picture that looks like Van Gogh that has this in it. And yeah you've mentioned a couple of times about God puts you where you wanted to do be and this kind of thing, but at the same time, I know again, I'm a big enough person to also realize that religions are yet.

[00:18:48] Another system that we've created. And so I tend to ask people about their faith journey as opposed to their religion or their religious journey. Cause to me, those are different things our [00:19:00] experience with spirituality and faith versus religion. Can you talk a little bit about your faith journey and how that's intersected to where you've arrived at today?

[00:19:08] Michaell Magrutsche: Obviously I was Roman Catholic because that's. Or I am Roman Catholic and but by systemic definition, I'm Roman Catholic, but I couldn't, there's pathfinders that are religious Boy Scouts that are religious and Catholic. I could not fit there. I could not make sense out of the services.

[00:19:34] And when I think about Jesus, and this is something I test with people that I say. Yeah. They'd say, oh, why don't you go to church or whatever? And I said, because when I think about Jesus, I feel good. And I don't know, because I think, I don't know, I feel really good. I feel there's no strains. There's no regulation.

[00:19:55] There's no rule. I just feel enlightened when I [00:20:00] think about it about the, but I feel enlightened when I think about Buddha, but not as much as Jesus. I just give you my honest feedback. And I, Mohammed and I feel these are all light people and, I feel very good about Jesus.

[00:20:19] I must say, when I think about it, even when I talk now, I feel very good. But when you talk to me about religion or Christianity, I don't feel anything. Nothing. It is blank. It is blank. I think it's just it's just the resonance and for me, the systemic, I'm very trying to come to the truth, find the truth.

[00:20:45] And because I couldn't find the truth in systems, if I would have fit into system, I would never look for the truth. so I, the, my, my faith journey is that [00:21:00] I, oh I wanted to marry, I was like 12 or no, 13. I fell in love with a girl and I, and she was Jewish and I and then I talked to the priest and whatever like then I went still to the, to mess and stuff, and. And it was like that was 40 years ago though and it said, yeah, you can go out with her don't have sex and all that other stuff. But thing and actually when I was 15 I resigned the Catholic church because of that. So they actually pushed me away.

[00:21:43] Because I couldn't put these things together. God loves everyone. But you can't marry that person. And I'm a religion and I literally I quit the Catholic church because of that. I've never told [00:22:00] anybody that. Yeah, this is what it was

[00:22:02] Scott Maderer: on you now. Yeah. And I, again I actually I've had an experience where I was raised in the church, but then I left the church for 20 some odd years and like you began to study a lot of different religions and do a lot of different things and then came back to the church, but it's not.

[00:22:22] It's with a different understanding of why and what I'm looking for and what it's about, if that makes sense. So I think a lot of people can echo with that feeling of I I believe in the higher power. I believe in God, I believe in Jesus even, but.

[00:22:44] The particular religion sometimes makes us feel uncomfortable because we don't fit in that way. It has a different set of rules. You talk a lot about creating art and you mentioned earlier that creativity part is the [00:23:00] side or whatever. And yet I know again, I talked to a lot of different people about a lot of different things and I've got a ton of podcast episodes out.

[00:23:08] Immediately people will say things like, how can you be that creative? To produce that many podcast episodes. I'm not creative. I can't do that. Yeah. Everyone says they're not creative and they believe they're not creative. And yet, or I'm not going to say everybody, a lot of people will say that they're not.

[00:23:28] And they struggle with that. Why do you think that is why do we push?

[00:23:32] Michaell Magrutsche: Because it's systemically conditioned. It's nobody to blame. It's nobody to shunt. It's systemically conditioned because in systems, the product is valuable. So you see, David Michelangelo's David and said, I can do it.

[00:23:50] You know what? I'm an artist since I was like a kid, 6 years old. All I did is music, painting, creating, building [00:24:00] forts in the forest and all this stuff. That's all I did. And I did photography, video. I still, I'm writing books. I'm constantly having flow. I don't have a writer's block ever. And people come to me and say they are not artists.

[00:24:19] And I said, everybody is an artist. It's you are an artist, but you're focused on what the outcome should be. It's almost like, how should a leader be? How should. a business person, entrepreneur be, how should a Christian be? It is the stereotypical, we are 8 billion different, unique, different person, people with our own fingerprints, our own DNA and our own eyes.

[00:24:48] How should it ever work when you become conscious, you can. And I'm, I think religion does a lot of good stuff to not just bad stuff, especially in the [00:25:00] in, in these days it's just not in the middle ages but now, and I think they do a lot of good stuff, but you always have to keep in mind.

[00:25:13] You have to use the religion, not the religion you have to use the system working in a company, use it for finding more of who you are use the system for everything that you finding more of who you are. And if you don't fit in this system, go to another system. You don't like this religion, go another one.

[00:25:36] But not that you submit to that religion, but to learn more of how you about yourself. It's all about yourself. And if people say, I'll be grateful. No, you are grateful. But when you look at that mind construct that I propagate. Is when you look at it, be human centric and use it for [00:26:00] yourself because when you are the best that you can be, we wouldn't have any problems in this world if you would just be the biggest.

[00:26:08] There's a reason the nature of God doesn't make mistakes. You're one of one. If you can discover and unveil the one of one that you are imagine. No, there wouldn't be. Oh, I want to be Scott. No, that wouldn't be it wouldn't be like, I want to be a thing. Yeah, boy. It would be, Oh, I'm Michael and there's Scott and I love to meet Scott because we are a reflection of each other.

[00:26:34] And when I have more parts of 8 billion, when I have, when I meet another part of it, then my part shines up because my part does it. It connects and it's all about collaboration and connection. And in that we are all creators. It is a together that we are all inclusive. Even the person, what happens with the person in the woods in the hut [00:27:00] that has not a dog or anything, he's talking to himself, you talk, you can't, you're a social animal by construct, you're constructing a social animal, so you talk to yourself, you observe, Oh, this wasn't, why the hell did I do this?

[00:27:16] You constantly talk to yourself, even if alone. So you never, the thing of loneliness is only disconnected from self. There is no such thing as loneliness because you're always a social animal. You can't be anything else as a social animal in, on this earth. So why not embracing that you're a social animal and connect with people that you like, not be people that you don't like.

[00:27:41] You don't need to hug everybody. This is all systemically, but just have a conversation. And you and I know. We meet people we have never talked to, but we just by the fact that we have to adapt to this technology, we just plug in. We don't say, Hey, introduce me to this person. So I know him and whatever. We [00:28:00] don't need that.

[00:28:00] Boom. That's the power of podcasting because it really shows our human centric

[00:28:05] Scott Maderer: values but I will say that's something I've had to learn how to do. When I was younger and I'm saying that out loud for folks, cause I think people think, Oh that's easy. No, you're not saying that's an easy thing.

[00:28:21] It's, but it's learning to talk to other people, learning to adapt to the situation. And even quite frankly, learning in my case, at least I'll speak for myself, learning to people who maybe I don't agree with, or I don't. I'm not 100% comfortable with, but I'm still going to value who you are and value what you believe and treat you like a human being not paint this caricature of because I know this little thing about you that maybe I don't like that must mean all of this other stuff is true that honestly, a lot of times isn't but we tend to do that.

[00:28:55] We label people with broad stereotypes, [00:29:00] caricatures once we, Learn a little bit about them. It becomes like, Oh, that must be all the, now I know everything I need to know about if you have this one little thing how do you see us learning to become true to ourselves, but also reflect on those relationships that we have, even the difficult ones that we have,

[00:29:22] Michaell Magrutsche: I think for number one, you gotta know that every diversification of race, gender, sexuality, politics.

[00:29:33] Is a system created conditioning, meaning, and this is over years, how can somebody become a Democrat that is Republican from his, from gen, then generation it's to adapt to your family tree, your DNA adapts. If you think, okay, why people are the worst people ever. How can you think that?[00:30:00]

[00:30:00] It's in your DNA. We know that PDSD people have five generations after that have PDSD stuff that in war of five years. That's why I always say war is so horrible because you're not looking, you're looking for the systemic victor, but you're not looking for what you're bringing back into your own country.

[00:30:21] Yeah. So I think, first of all, you need to see this is systemically made. So they you need to see that, okay, we gonna put the guys in the war and the woman just cook and make more warriors. That's their job. And there you have already the first classification. Then we conquer new new land.

[00:30:42] They look different. Since we are the conquerors, we won the war or whatever. We must be better than the red scheme. We have more

[00:30:50] Scott Maderer: value because we won. That's why we won red.

[00:30:51] Michaell Magrutsche: Exactly. Exactly. And the red scheme people that worked here, we don't even call him. I mean we started now. But when I [00:31:00] was thinking, there wasn't even a nation or anything they were just running around in the wild.

[00:31:05] They weren't considered. We didn't

[00:31:07] Scott Maderer: treat them in a human way at all. Yeah.

[00:31:09] Michaell Magrutsche: Yeah, we don't treat them as a human way. And it is a, it's a short sightedness because. I told you I, 40 years ago, growing up in, in Europe after the war not right after the war but I haven't seen a black person.

[00:31:28] I have, I grew up, never seen a black person and have a lot of interaction with black people and have no, I don't even see them as black people. Or green people or agenda or because the art community, everybody is welcome there. It's not about more diverse. Yeah, it's so diverse because again, it brings it shows it the blueprint.

[00:31:52] What is humanly possible. If there is a religion for everything is art that's the religion for everybody[00:32:00] because it shows you what is possible. What can we do? How can we lift our human potential? That's what I'm all about. And I think once you know that you were conditioned over generations, so not a blame or finger pointing or Oh, I've got to be politically correct that we that we separated it and that became a categorized and then it became stereotype.

[00:32:25] And then the stereotype integrated, then you can look at humans as humans and say, and try it. And it's you said, yeah, it's not easy, but what is not easy? It's not easy to talk in front of people because the preconceived notions of talking in front. Haven't you heard? I can't even connect with that anymore.

[00:32:49] The biggest fear in the world is speaking in front of people. I can't even. The

[00:32:54] Scott Maderer: fear of death is actually second, which actually means people would rather be in the coffin than [00:33:00] deliver the eulogy.

[00:33:02] Michaell Magrutsche: I know. I know. And we die every night for talkers. That's wait, what?

[00:33:09] The people that have a fear of death, they get, they sleep every night.

[00:33:12] You're dead at night. You're not in, you're not conscious that you're in your physical body. You're not physical at night. So you're dying every night. So people that have extreme death, you die every night. At which point they can no longer sleep at night. Exactly. Yeah.

[00:33:30] No, I agree. I agree.

[00:33:32] But you've got to face that because death is a part of being alive too.

[00:33:37] Scott Maderer: And honestly, I would argue in a way, the fear of public speaking and the fear of death are actually. at some level, the same fear in that the reason most people have a fear of public speaking is they're fearing social death or societal death or this being ostracized, being kicked out of the tribe, embarrassment those things, those are social death.[00:34:00]

[00:34:00] The other is a fear of physical death. They're both death and in some ways we actually fear social death, being kicked out of the system, being kicked out of the tribe is more fearful to us than physical death in some ways.

[00:34:18] Michaell Magrutsche: Yeah. If you can't fit to the tribe or the tribe doesn't accept you which is DNA driven.

[00:34:24] See when you can compartmentalize that, it's okay to be afraid. It's okay to be thinking, Oh, I understand why I'm afraid because my DNA says I got to make that speech and have those people. That's my DNA drive. It's not my systemic drive. Oh, if I don't make this, I'm going to have no money tomorrow. I'm just thinking if I had all the money.

[00:34:45] And I'm still afraid of talking to the people that it is that the fear exactly that you said that I will not be accepted in the tribe that I will be rejected from the tribe. And that is and so [00:35:00] that's why we go into groups because we know this group I can talk to. They're not going to reject me because inclusion is always the dominant thing.

[00:35:09] Inclusion is the, so to systemize us into different genders, race, sexuality, politics. I heard today, I hear it a couple of times, but today it really hit me deep that people are now more against you marrying a different political party than a different race. They made so so they say, it's okay.

[00:35:39] You married this other race or whatever. That's more acceptable. But don't so the systemic, how can we submit to systems like that? Use politics. Politics are here to serve you, the human to connect you and make the system versus the [00:36:00] human interact. And all they do is discuss. systemic stuff and not human stuff.

[00:36:06] When have you last heard, other than saying you're the American people, but when have you last heard? Human centric just makes a lot of sense that we do this or that. No, it's all about system. We can save money, we can give more things, and it's always promises. A lot

[00:36:24] Scott Maderer: of times, they're self sustaining, meaning in other words, and again, this isn't Democrat, Republican, this is all political system.

[00:36:32] The idea of this political system is to give more power to people within the political system, so that the political system has more power. It's a little Hampshire wheel that just keeps running the same direction. Yeah,

[00:36:47] Michaell Magrutsche: and that's why nobody's interested anymore in anything, and which is bad because then they can do whatever they want.

[00:36:53] Yeah. So more and more if you talk about non sec with us, nobody's interested [00:37:00] it's just people tune out and people are waking up. They don't watch. I think podcast the first time for the months has higher ratings 80s 89 versus. 67 million in America. Wow. So this is this.

[00:37:20] So people want to hear natural topic. You and I talk because they don't want their regurgitate dated, constructed free to get the most audience or the right audience or whatever. They just want to have 2 people talk. They gonna make, they have to have five, six senses themselves. They wanna relate and learn from it because as a podcast is a listening me medium. Everybody listens. You listen to me. I listen to you. And the podcasters the guests the people that plug in, listen to. So it's actually, we learn, we teaching the people to listen again. It's a good [00:38:00] start. Are you kidding me? It's a great start. And we see that people want that.

[00:38:06] They don't want just be passive and said, okay, and now I have to copy that what I just heard.

[00:38:13] Scott Maderer: So I've got a few questions that I like to ask everybody, but before I do that, is there, there anything else about the work you do or what we've been talking about today that you think you'd like to share with the listener?

[00:38:25] Michaell Magrutsche: I would say answer the question for you. If there's 1 thing I say no, what, when you're stressed or when something really bogus you, is this a systemic problem? You can't pay your rent tomorrow. That would be a systemic pay, but. If your child doesn't have a roof over their head is a human problem.

[00:38:54] So really try to separate what is human centric and what is system centric, because I [00:39:00] don't want a mother ever, which is, and everybody can relate to this, that a mother with a sick child feels guilty that she doesn't go to work. That should never be from a human centric point out of where are we, that we feel guilty to take care of what.

[00:39:19] The next generation that we that it should be like totally easy to just pick up the phone and say, Hey, I don't come in. Okay. We handle it for you. And that's leadership we handle the team is taking care of it. The team shouldn't be responsible on the one or given the thing we are we are, we're dependent on you coming to work.

[00:39:41] That is absolutely a no. And if you have that, that you're my life cut. I'm a different person. I wake up. I, but if you condition yourself back to where you belong at the human century, and if anybody wants to [00:40:00] connect with me I have Michael M. com, which is the Michael with two L's M.

[00:40:06] com. And you can follow all this stuff and connect to me.

[00:40:15] So

[00:40:15] Scott Maderer: one of the I run my brand through kind of the stewardship. That's the concept that I use. That's the idea that I use. That's one of the things that. that you said attracted you to, to me and coming on the show, when you hear that word stewardship I've learned people hear different things and understand different things from the word.

[00:40:36] What does that word mean to you and what do you think is important about it for you?

[00:40:42] Michaell Magrutsche: We can connect what I just said what is So the other word of stewardship would be leadership. So leadership is system relevant. Why? Because it is for this system, in this system, being a [00:41:00] leader, doing your job for a certain amount of time.

[00:41:04] Stewardship is for, it's human centric because it is sustainable. It's about sustainability. It's about humans. It's about humanity. And it's human relevant. It is, it's not Oh, right now for the next five years, I'm going to be a steward and then I'm stopping. Stewardship is an ongoing thing that is coming.

[00:41:30] You can hand over the stewardship to some other person or other persons, but the stewardship is actually I would say a contextual understanding of the part that you have. The part in humanity that represent, and I love stewardship. I love stewardship because stewardship is, it is not, [00:42:00] it's not, oh, we need to make the most profit right now.

[00:42:03] It's about how I'm getting this idea or this how do I nurture it? It's also, there's a lot of nurturing, how to adapt and nurture. It's so much more human centric than system relevant. Leader is system relevant, even though. Being a leader being effective leader, you should also be, yeah, needs to be human centric again.

[00:42:30] But I think that was a great question because we explained what is human centric. What is the best leaders actually are good stewards, but not all leaders are good stewards

[00:42:44] and everybody wants to be a leader because you do the dirty work that I don't want to do. You know that. I think why does everybody wants to be a leader?

[00:42:52] And nobody, I always ask the question, why does everybody wants to be a leader and nobody wants to be just a good worker? [00:43:00] It's always, you want to be a leader that you can do the horrible system work. And that's just got to be now with AI. That the horrible systems work that you don't want to do, fill out forms and do all this stuff.

[00:43:13] Put in data that somebody else does, that you can delegate that to somebody else. And this is going to be the big hope in AI. Yeah, it's got to do with the dirty work, oh and of course the big fear is it may do all of the work. But I still think there's a place for humanity, no matter what.

[00:43:34] Scott Maderer: Systemic work. I'm hopeful.

[00:43:37] Michaell Magrutsche: The systemic work it doesn't do anything. AI. Have you ever heard anybody ask, what does AI do for humans? For the human centric part of it. It does only that we have the system. Yeah, we had it. We have our output since computers is eight times. higher since we have per person, how much higher is it going to [00:44:00] be with AI?

[00:44:01] Do you have, since the computer more time? I don't I, you get you got 10 letters before now you get a hundred letters with AI. You get 300 letters. They look like letters from your friends. So it's making you a better system worker, but it takes more time and to get to sort, sift and sort through.

[00:44:25] So it, I don't think it's the it's gotta be, it has, obviously everything has a plus and a minus, a lot of advantages in terms of being making mistakes, system mistakes, because human centric, there is no mistakes. There's only in systems is systemically the mistakes and failures, and it's got to help that, but and will helps probably me as a neurodiverse and dyslexic person to communicate better with other people.

[00:44:53] I wrote six books and I have the computer to read it to me so I use, but that's [00:45:00] what I advocate. I said, use systems for that. You can expand who you are. Don't submit to systems or sacrifice to systems.

[00:45:09] Scott Maderer: So this is my favorite question that I like to ask everybody. So imagine for a minute that I invented some sort of magic machine and with the power of this machine, I was able to pluck you from where you are today and transport you into the future.

[00:45:23] maybe 150, maybe 250 years. Through the power of this machine, you are able to look back and see your entire life, see all of the connections, all of the ripples, everything that you've left behind in the world. What impact do you hope you've left behind

[00:45:37] Michaell Magrutsche: in the world?

[00:45:41] It's like dying, right? Are we coming back to our theme? This is the nicer version of the write your own autopsy question or write your own obituary question. I try to make it nicer than, hey, write your obituary. But yeah, that's basically what the question is.

[00:45:58] I'm [00:46:00] happy. I'm happy if they think about me and smile.

[00:46:07] Really, Because that's what it is. I'm a part. And if I made you smile, if you think, because there's people in my life, when I think about them, I get such a jolt. I just think about them. I don't think, Oh, I got to go golfing or do this or that. I'm just thinking about them. And I've such a, and then I go to my phone because I'm so enlightened and laugh about it.

[00:46:35] I take the phone and call them. And even if I don't reach him, I leave him a message. And I, yeah. I think that is all we can do, actually. I don't want them to think I was a great entrepreneur. I don't want them to say I'm Steve Jobs. Everybody looks at Jeeves Sharp because what he did, but not who he was.

[00:46:56] No, in

[00:46:57] Scott Maderer: fact, a lot of people will talk about who he was and not real [00:47:00] good

[00:47:00] Michaell Magrutsche: terms. Yeah, no but nobody I but still it's in not because he was all system. He was saying we break the system. Then he turned, it was all system and he's, he did what he had to do, but yeah this would be my thing.

[00:47:17] They think it about me when they think about it. I'm not saying they should think about me 24 hours, but when they think about me, they have a smile. They don't feel like. Cringing that's a good goal. So what's coming next? What's on your roadmap as you finish out the year? Okay, Scott,

[00:47:35] I don't have any goals.

[00:47:37] What do you say to that? I am an anti Goldman. I I see what comes up. Obviously I'm finishing my book, but I tell you what I wrote, I started to talk about AI and I just wrote that started to write two pages on AI which like, it's three months ago. I have now 65 [00:48:00] pages that are already shortened.

[00:48:02] They're already shortened. So there's so much, and I wasn't expecting this, but I think it is very important. AI issue is important to take the fears away. So I have a look on AI and I don't know how to promote it. If I put it in the book as a chapter or if I put it out in little parts. But basically, the basically is what are the human centric advantages?

[00:48:27] How can we use AI human centric Lee to help us to help humans, not the system, make the system better. We are so good at system. We can't even catch up. And there's a lot of people that they say our technology is 300 times increased than our human in the last 200 years. Then our human potential.

[00:48:52] I want to draw, I want to draw AI to the human side. I want to actually not worry about [00:49:00] it or whatever. I said, what can, if AI is so freaking good. Then why do we still have wars? Why do we still do this stuff? This stupid human systemic how can we get rid of discrimination?

[00:49:20] How can we solve one problem? For example, we are most of our Problems are systemically created. Humans problems are systemically created, and then they find out to make another system to fix that human problem. Like Black Lives Matter. You cannot do this systemically. You can only fix your racism by talking to people, being with people to see the truth.

[00:49:49] Then the truth is we are all the same. We're just one of one of 8 billion people. And how can AI amplify that? Instead of [00:50:00] amplifying technology, how can AI help solve this, or help solve that? Systemically, not systemically, meaning that it is, how can we integrate with nature, not save nature?

[00:50:18] Because see, we're so distracted from, we want to see,

[00:50:22] Scott Maderer: we always laugh when people say, save the planet. I'm like, the planet is going to do just fine. It's whether or not we're here. That's the problem.

[00:50:30] Michaell Magrutsche: And the funny thing is we. We destroy our habitat, right?

[00:50:35] Scott Maderer: We'll destroy where we live and we may all die, but the planet's

[00:50:41] Michaell Magrutsche: dinosaurs don't live in a live either, but the planet went on and nature went on.

[00:50:45] So how can AI help us to organically integrate nature into systems? There is a question. I don't hear anybody ask because the money is, it does your dirty work. You don't have to do [00:51:00] this anymore.

[00:51:01] Scott Maderer: It creates a better

[00:51:02] Michaell Magrutsche: product easier. Yeah, easier, but it doesn't it doesn't. It gives you a better research.

[00:51:09] It's a real good research tool, but you have to still go and do it because it does too many hallucinations. Meaning it fills in data stuff

[00:51:19] Scott Maderer: and extra it extrapolates false information. Yet. Yeah. doesn't tell you that it's false information. There, there was actually a case where a lawyer used it for legal research and it made up a whole bunch of legal cases that didn't really exist and he turned them into the judge and got himself in trouble.

[00:51:34] Michaell Magrutsche: God sakes, we have the judge. Imagine this, the judge is also AI and tried to fill in that.

[00:51:41] Scott Maderer: The judge looked at it and went, wait a minute, this isn't right. Something's wrong. Yeah. So you can find out more about Michael over on his website. It's at MichaelM. com. That's M I C H A E L M. com.

[00:51:57] And of course, I'll have a link to that over in the show notes [00:52:00] as well. Michael, any last words for the

[00:52:02] Michaell Magrutsche: listeners?

[00:52:08] Humans are limitless if you look at it. And with other humans, with other eight billions. No technology can ever be as good as we, and we can't submit to any systems or technology if we have to work with each other, collaborate. and become more human centric again. That's what we lost.

[00:52:44] Scott Maderer: Thanks so much for listening to the Inspired Stewardship Podcast. As a subscriber and listener, we challenge you to not just sit back and passively listen, but act on what you've heard and find a way to live your [00:53:00] calling. If you enjoyed this episode please do us a favor. Go over to inspired stewardship.

[00:53:08] com slash. iTunes rate. All one word. iTunes rate. It'll take you through how to leave a rating and review and how to make sure you're subscribed to the podcast so that you can get every episode as it comes out in your feed. Until next time, invest your time, your talent, and your treasures. Develop your influence and impact the world.